Over the weekend, one of the most read articles in the New York Times was about proposals to create more alternatives to college. Proponents say that college is not needed for many jobs.
Among those calling for such alternatives are the economists Richard K.
Vedder of Ohio University and Robert I. Lerman of American University,
the political scientist Charles Murray, and James E. Rosenbaum, an
education professor at Northwestern. They would steer some students
toward intensive, short-term vocational and career training, through
expanded high school programs and corporate apprenticeships.“It is true that we need more nanosurgeons than we did 10 to 15 years ago,” said Professor Vedder, founder of the Center for College Affordability and Productivity,
a research nonprofit in Washington. “But the numbers are still
relatively small compared to the numbers of nurses’ aides we’re going
to need. We will need hundreds of thousands of them over the next
decade.”
Instead of a B.A., students could be getting Associate degrees in community colleges and vocational schools.
I am a huge fan of community colleges. One of my old high school classmates is making more as EKG technician with her AA from Bergen Community College than most of my friends with PhDs in philosophy. Students know this, and are signing up for community colleges in record numbers. Our local community college is splitting at the seams. This is the one area of higher education that has seen growth in recent years.
The one downside of pushing people out of four-year colleges is that they quickly hit career roadblocks without a BA in hand. Another friend is fabulous at her retail store. She's clearly management material, but without a BA, her corporate office won't consider for those higher level jobs.
Apt. 11d 
The one downside of pushing people out of four-year colleges is that quickly hit career roadblocks without a BA in hand. … clearly management material, but without a BA, her corporate office won’t consider for those higher level jobs.
I suspect that for Murray’s fellow travelers this is a feature rather than a bug.
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“clearly management material, but without a BA, her corporate office won’t consider for those higher level jobs.
I suspect that for Murray’s fellow travelers this is a feature rather than a bug.”
I’ve seen too many brilliant/capable people tripped up by the “BA” requirement (I’m thinking, for example, of the MIT admissions director who turned out not to have a BA, and having lied about it) to think that this makes real sense, as long as the BA remains a requirement for jobs for which it shouldn’t be. That’s the problem that encourages people to get degrees that they don’t need. The nurse’s aide, for example, can never move beyond being a nurse’s aide, if she has the AA degree, and presuming that person is going to be a “nanosurgeon” is the straw man comparison. Their other alternative would be an RN, and as an RN, they might have an opportunity to participate either as a direct care nurse or as a supervisor, or administrator, and potentially, if it struck them as they moved through the system, as an academic, health insurance CEO, . . . .
The MIT director of admissions didn’t need to have a BA (really, I don’t think she did). She had proven, amply, that she could do her job. The politicians who lie about their college degrees don’t need them either. But as long as those career roadblocks exist, I’m not going to tell anyone that they shouldn’t complete their 4 year college degree.
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But as long as those career roadblocks exist, I’m not going to tell anyone that they shouldn’t complete their 4 year college degree.
Unfortunately, I have to agree. I strongly believe, both for ideological reasons and reasons having simply to do with the nature of my job teaching today, that everyone would be better off if our economy was less structured around a standardized meritocracy, and more institutionally rewarding of people who develop their talents and skills through apprenticeships, community colleges, etc. But until and unless there are some across-the-board changes or reforms that oblige economic gatekeepers to recognize such training, and thus make possible the aforementioned restructuring, then getting that BA remains essential for most people who want a middle-class life.
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And, as with other things, the employees can’t lead on this. I think the most concrete way that such a plan could be implemented which doesn’t create the class system effects (trapping people in a class, and what Doug refers to as a “feature” of the Murray crowd), is for employers to pay for this “vocational” training and then guarantee employment for its graduates for some period of time. I.e. if nurse’s aides are necessary, pay for nursing education, and guarantee employment for some period of time, and do this in a short enough period of time so that people who availed themselves of this option could then go get a 4 year degree, after having worked for some number of years, if they wanted to.
Of course, we already have options like this, of a kind (the military, for example, police academies), etc. But, the employers have to front the money, otherwise, it sounds a lot like a system designed to offer substandard education to a tracked group of people and forever trap them in their class.
(And, I agree that the Murray folks might see this as a feature. They might also think that standardized testing of some sort would help us pick who we should track).
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And what are the earning prospects for a nursing aide? How much of that job relies on physical strength and agility that fades over time?
This is also part of the economic shift that seeks to peel off as much work as possible on lightly-trained and poorly-paid workers who rarely enjoy any sort of job security and have little hope of promotion. I’m all for colleges (here in Canada, that’s where the vocational training is carried out) but it’s not a great prescription for someone to train for what employers see as an interchangeable, near minimum wage position.
It would be nice if employers and colleges could support upgrading of skills and qualifications in a modular program but that’d be a mammoth undertaking.
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As long as this “not everyone needs to go to college” doesn’t come paired with gratuitous sneers at “useless degrees in English and Art History.” This kind of polarizing doesn’t do much for what I see as a real value of apprenticeships, associate’s degrees and the like: upgrading the skills of the kids who don’t have the inclination or talent to get BA’s, who prefer working with their hands, and so on. And not just working-class young men, either, though this category of young men is the one who is increasingly left behind in our economy.
Janice also has an excellent point – what about pay and working conditions for nurse’s aides and other jobs that traditionally pay little and demand much? Who is going to want to be a nurse’s aide if the job continues to be undesirable?
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I think the kind of system the commenters are talking about already exists in healthcare– I have a friend who is graduating this weekend with a two-year degree in nursing, and has already secured a job at a hospital that will pay for him to get his BSN and even MSN if he gets into those programs. I think this is somewhat standard practice, at least in MD, which is admittedly a strong area for healthcare employment.
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Unlike Lake Wobegone, in the United States, half the children are below average. They are the ones who are really being screwed by the ‘college for all’ fetish: they can’t do it. They get through couple of years with declining ‘c’ grades, then drop out with $40000 of debt. Or if they do bumble through Directional State to a degree, they have no profs who will go to the mat for them (“Duane C.? My records show that I had him for Soc. 215 last year. I don’t remember him, though”) and they have $80,000 in debt and no one will hire them.
It’s a credential which enables hiring officials to justify hiring someone promising. But, a dull time-server with a college degree is a dull time-server. A dull time-server with phlebotomy training is employed.
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A dull time-server with phlebotomy training is employed.
Ever since I heard of Twilight, I’ve started to worry about the future of phlebotomy. That is exactly the place where you want a time-server. At the very least, you want to be a bit nervous around one who enjoys their job too much.
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Also, shoe salemen. If one seems really happy about his job, buy your shoes at a different store.
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Vedder’s nurses aid example is a poor one – they are low-paid and low-skilled. The whole point of vocational education is to acquire skills with sufficient value to earn a decent living.
No one seems to be making a point I think is important – many eighteen year olds are not mature enough to make the most of the college experience. A $80k to $200k degree is too expensive to spend on someone who is still unfocused, unsure of direction, distracted by social life, etc.
I see vocational training and a few years of work experience as excellent prep for college.
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