There's been a lot of buzz about the book, Alone Together: Why We Expect More from Technology and Less from Each Other
Most of my friends use Facebook very lightly as a way to distribute photos of kids, announce a big snowfall, or pass around a really cool link. I've been logging on less and less in recent months, because there's less to read.
I also have some control over fakery on Facebook. For no particular reason, I've decided that Twitter is for work and Facebook is for friends. I don't mind career bragging on Twitter, but it bugs the crap out of me on Facebook. If someone starts bragging about their careers too much on Facebook, I put them in the paddy wagon for a month and secretly block their posts from my newsfeed.
So, my Facebook friends don't make me feel inferior. That's what the Style Section of the New York Times is for. Here's another hipster hotel that I'll probably never visit.
Apt. 11d 
I mostly use Facebook the way I use blogs, except that I can’t make jokes about peoples’ kids so most stuff just passes unremarked upon.
LikeLike
Yeah, when I finally joined I was surprised at how many people were using Facebook in a totally transparent self-promotional way — especially authors or sole proprietors (therapists, consultants, etc.) I blocked a bunch of people.
All I want to see on there is pictures of kids, darnit!
LikeLike
Only one person on my FB was using it for business purposes and she had been unemployed for months before trying to start a business and is back to normal now that she was a job. I didn’t block her. I almost blocked a dozen people before I figured out how to block Farmville.
LikeLike
I also do the Facebook=friends, Twitter=work (on a side project, not my employer) distinction. However, I’m not quite sure I get your annoyance. There’s a sense in which I’m actually a fan of the distant cousins, elementary classmates, and college friends on Facebook — I’m rooting for them and would like to know when good stuff happens to them. In particular, I’m not competing with them.
So I was kind of amazed when a friend on FB (who often posts strong opinions on politics and parenting) refrained from mentioning that her book got accepted to a series she’d submitted it to. I understand that that sort of thing might be considered bragging among her academic colleagues, but I’d bet the majority of her FB friends (who aren’t writing books or in academia) would be delighted to see that announcement.
A Facebook world that’s grounded in historical real-life acquaintanceships will be more diverse than almost any self-selecting online community, so I feel like the rules of what’s regarded as bragging are different. I’m thrilled–but not jealous–that your son made the varsity team this year, or that your new deer feeder is working out so well on the lease, or that you had a great time drinking beer on speedboats last summer, or that you got that sabbatical fellowship in Germany, or that the new piglets your sow had last night are so cute. Short of saying “look at how beautiful and wealthy I am”, I find it hard to take offense.
Or at least it’s far harder to take offense at a Facebook friend’s personal achievements than at their political and religious opinions. *groan!*
LikeLike
I hadn’t heard of that book before, but I can kind of get the argument, based on my experience with my law school classmates’ use of FB. Most of my classmates are 10-15 years younger than I am, and there are quite a lot of pictures of parties (and duckface hugs) and social lives in general (whereas, yeah, my college/grad school friends who are my age generally post kid pics). And it is sort of dumb, but I do come away from my classmates’ pics thinking they’re all having a hell of a lot more fun than I am (even though 1) I did the same kind of thing when I was at their life stage and 2) I don’t really actually want to do the staying out late/drinking kinds of parties any more). Thankfully, the fact that they *are* 10-15 years younger than me means I don’t really compare myself to them, but it is a teeny bit depressing, and I can see being a teen and getting bent out of shape about it. Since feeling inferior generally is a lot easier when you’re a teen!
(Conversely, my usual reaction to the Style section of the Times is, WTF?? But never having lived in NYC, I’ve never connected that to anyone’s actual real lives.)
Haven’t come across a lot of self-promotion among my friends on FB, actually (though that may be because all my friends are academics or law students and it doesn’t lend itself). Whereas on Twitter, I block any and all commercial followers. (Don’t mind links to latest blog posts, though I find it vaguely annoying if the ONLY thing you tweet is links to your latest blog posts.)
LikeLike
I also like hearing about people’s successes and achievements (and that of their children). I think where I differentiate that from self-promotion is whether they’re trying to get me to buy/offer something. Not sure how I feel about output that’s targeted at more than one group of people (for example, a cookbook writer who I read for fun, but who is clearly also targeting publishers). I think there, I enjoy their work, I don’t mind being part of the promotion process.
As in, if I can help someone get their book published, well, that’s good thing. I hope I’d feel that way even if I was trying to publish a book of my own, but since I’m not it hard to tell.
I have been in that kind of situation before, and if the system feels fair to everyone, then one can compete with friends. It’s harder when it’s not fair (when, for example, if the person who had the brighter smile gets the job to write the code for the mars lander).
LikeLike
Sounds a lot like the same thing that Turkle was writing a dozen years ago, only it was about BBSes, chat rooms, MMORPGs and the various hangouts on the nascent Web. Plus ça change?
LikeLike
I like Turkle and am looking forward to the book, but I’m more interested in how computers/social media change us cognitively than how they change us socially, if that makes sense.
So, am I the only person who deliberately posts on FB anti-wingnut stuff in order to educate hardline right-wing relatives? I plan to taunt my cousin G soon about his support of Mangano in Nassau County.
LikeLike
Ben,
“Or at least it’s far harder to take offense at a Facebook friend’s personal achievements than at their political and religious opinions. *groan!*”
meet Wendy:
“So, am I the only person who deliberately posts on FB anti-wingnut stuff in order to educate hardline right-wing relatives? I plan to taunt my cousin G soon about his support of Mangano in Nassau County.”
If the shoe were on the other foot, would you enjoy being “educated” by your wingnut relatives and neighbors via FB? Have they successfully changed any of your opinions yet?
I’m not on FB, although I think about it every so so often, since it’s a major channel for family news among the cousins. However, I really, really don’t want to be found by at least two people I can think of, so I’m fine hearing stuff via the old-fashioned family grapevine.
LikeLike
“If the shoe were on the other foot, would you enjoy being “educated” by your wingnut relatives and neighbors via FB? Have they successfully changed any of your opinions yet?”
Presumably no, but that would be because Wendy is right and they are wrong. That does happen (for example, on Mangano in Nassau county). And a myriad of other topics. It’s non-trivial to figure out what is fact and opinion (in spite in doing so at the Arthur cartoon web site). But, non-triviality of making the decision doesn’t change the fact that there are opinions and facts.
I’m not a facebook user, though I’ve been wading in slowly. I think I am in the other boat, since I accidentally friended someone who I know in a social context who has political opinions I probably strongly diagree with (and who seems to use Facebook mostly for the purpose of promulgating those views. I don’t think that means that I should tell him how to use Facebook, merely that I have to figure out a way to deal.
LikeLike
I did unfriend a guy for his political status updates, but he was posting white supremacist stuff. And not veiled or iffy stuff either.
LikeLike
“If the shoe were on the other foot, would you enjoy being “educated” by your wingnut relatives and neighbors via FB?”
Yes. If I were wrong, I’d be happy to find that out. If my logic were faulty, I’d want to know that it was. I am serious.
What’s wrong with this world right now is that we all hunker down in our nice little closed epistemic systems. Not you or anyone here, obviously. But the problem is pretty prevalent among the general Facebook user.
Also, my cousins (and the rest of my wingnut family members) know damned well that I am my father’s daughter, so they are never surprised when I eviscerate their logic. 🙂 My high school friends are always a little nonplussed, though they should remember I was in Model Congress. 🙂
LikeLike
And, actually, I think discussing these things with family/friends is far more important than other kinds of political discussion. My family and friends know who I am. They’ve met me, met my kids, or seen their pics on FB. They’re unlikely to develop some sort of dehumanizing hatred for me. They know I’m not a socialist; I’m just a human being who has tons of shared experiences with them. They know I’m motivated by a hope for a better world for our kids… and I know the same about them. They are precisely the people I should be talking to about political stuff. If they won’t listen, it’s because I challenge the ideas taught to them by Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh, etc. that liberals are stupid evil people who just want a socialist utopia. I challenge the tribalism that is taught to them.
I think you ALL should share your political beliefs on Facebook if you want to ever make a difference in the world.
LikeLike
Quoting David Bowie today brought me a claim that Nixon was hounded by “the left”. Hounded all the way into the White House. Twice.
LikeLike
The problem with discussing politics on Facebook is that your readers have no more reason to pay attention to your opinion than you do to theirs. There’s just very little I have to say about politics to a former science nerd who now lists “prayer in schools” as one of his likes and posts climate change denial rants.
When I post about politics, it’s going to be a fairly obscure subject about which I have some expertise (Net Neutrality, why Kay Bailey Hutchinson shouldn’t be on the tech committee [but I repeat myself!]), it’s going to be rare, and it’s going to be a topic on which I’m pretty sure that most readers haven’t made up their minds.
LikeLike
Quoting David Bowie today brought me a claim that Nixon was hounded by “the left”. Hounded all the way into the White House. Twice.
Nixon was hounded by the left, just not very effectively.
LikeLike
The vibe I’m getting is that everybody has their own set of personal FB rules and they get frustrated that others aren’t doing FB “right.”
LikeLike
John Scalzi sees it sorta the other way around, “Facebook is what happens to the Web when you hit it with the stupid stick.”
Anyway, I was more amused than frustrated.
MH, I guess the so-called hounding had a checkered past?
LikeLike
Now I want a spaniel. It’s just so hard to find a good one these day and so hard to keep them without a decent yard.
LikeLike
Wendy, I like the way you think. The wife of a cousin — I’ve never actually met her — posted something I considered offensive (bemoaning the lack of religion in public schools, seriously?) and I sat on my hands. Completely on the fence about responding. Maybe I should have.
Laura, have you seen this? It’s about how women over 40 have more FB friends than you’d think, but what I found interesting was the way the study separated FB users into six types, who each have their own motivations for interaction. For myself, I like FB quite a bit despite itself.
LikeLike
It also occured to me that I don’t have a single FB friend (excepting my wife) who doesn’t live at least 100 miles away. That probably keeps me from using FB for much in the way of running an actual social life.
LikeLike
“I’ve never actually met her — posted something I considered offensive (bemoaning the lack of religion in public schools, seriously?) and I sat on my hands. Completely on the fence about responding. Maybe I should have.”
I think that was the right call. Why alienate a relative before you meet her?
I still haven’t heard any stories of people having Road to Damascus experiences from other people’s FB postings.
LikeLike
I still haven’t heard any stories of people having Road to Damascus experiences from other people’s FB postings.
I once thought somebody’s baby was ugly, but there were a few dozen people saying things like “what a cutey-pie” so I realized I was wrong.
LikeLike
Re Road to Damascus conversions: Who says anyone is looking for that? I want my relatives and friends to stop posting made-up shit on FB. I now have one relative and one HS friend who always read Snopes before posting anything now. And another old HS friend posted a link about some right-wing thing, then posted he had looked up the guy and yes, he was pretty shady (because the guy in the link was some wingnut liar), but he thought the points were good anyway. That’s all I ask–some critical thinking and evaluation of sources.
LikeLike
Another fun interchange with distant family: my cousin in FL posted that crap about how kids aren’t allowed to say the Pledge in schools any more. I called bullshit on that, of course, as I can literally HEAR the Pledge of Allegiance being recited in my son’s school across the street (for some reason the school has a loudspeaker outside). She said they can’t in FL (not entirely true, but there is enough wiggle room there with a recent court decision that I could cut her some slack) And maybe, just maybe, it made her think a little how weird it is that in Conservative Utopia Florida with a Republican governor and good conservative values yadda yadda, they have Pledge issues, but in liberal commie Taxachusetts, with a black Democratic governor, where gay marriage was going to bring on the frickin’ Apocalypse, we say the Pledge.
LikeLike
Oh, I love Facebook. And I do have moments where it really connects me to my hometown and high school.
I am from a rural, racially diverse town (local university is a HBC)and I accept friend requests (and make them) to all of my former classmates, whether we were friends in school or not. Their status messages remind me of my childhood and also point out to differences (in culture and social expectation) that I never understood then. It’s wonderful and also quite compelling.
And it provides me an opportunity to chat with my international friends. (Doug and I, for example, have an in-person friendship built on virtual connections, thanks to laura.)
Far from atomizing me, Facebook connects me and allows me tremendous networking opportunities.
But yes, YMMV
LikeLike
I want my relatives and friends to stop posting made-up shit on FB.
So, people should do this:
“There is no way I’d ever remember your birthday if FB didn’t put it up on the screen. Since I noticed and it only takes 6 seconds, I wanted to acknowledge that you’ve gotten a year older.”
“Finding out that you are about to become a grandfather fills me with both great relief and great jealousy that you, who are actually a year younger than me, can bounce a baby on your knee and then bugger off to Arizona for a week whenever it gets cold.”
“Great to hear from you. Is that a recent picture? Somebody reliable told me you got hooked on meth and I can’t help but wonder if your teeth still look perfect and your cheeks remain puffy.”
LikeLike
“I now have one relative and one HS friend who always read Snopes before posting anything now.”
That’s better. In spite of its reputation, Snopes can be kind of dodgy with some of the stuff it declares a myth. Their treatment of CPSIA (the infamous lead hysteria legislation) was sloppy and dismissive of legitimate concerns based on the wording of the legislation.
For a description of what Snopes got wrong with regard to CPSIA:
http://grecowoodcrafting.wordpress.com/2009
/01/15/snopes-is-wrong-on-the-cpsia/
For a description of the CPSIA issue:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CPSIA
Speaking of misconceptions, I think bj was recently the victim of the NYT’s poor reporting or poor writing (your pick). She mentioned something in the Loughner case about Loughner making anti-abortion statements, when in actuality, Loughner was making a dead baby joke at the expense of a young classmate who was very emotional about a poem she had written about her abortion.
Interestingly, Ann Coulter was the person to catch this one:
http://www.bucksright.com/coulter-notices-ny-times-transforms-loughner-into-anti-abortion-zealot-6424
“‘A girl had written a poem about an abortion. It was very emotional and she was teary eyed and he said something about strapping a bomb to the fetus and making a baby bomber,’ Ali said.”
Here’s the Times’ version: “After another student read a poem about getting an abortion, Mr. Loughner compared the young woman to a ‘terrorist for killing the baby.‘”
LikeLike
As such things go, Snopes is pretty good. It’s a far cry from religioustolerance.org, whose shoddy references send earnest-but-mistaken truth-tellers editing the Wikipedia article on Easter every March to provide opportunities for my Lenten penance.
Regarding politics on Facebook, I’m very much in favor of participating in discussion via the comments to someone else’s note or status. I just refrain from initiating the conversation unless it meets the narrow criteria I outlined.
LikeLike